BobbyO Posted October 1, 2015 SSR Team Share Posted October 1, 2015 Seeing as we are all as crazy as Rock on here ( joke, joke , i'll add a little more. I think what Rock says may have some legs, to me it's not completely out of the realms of possibility that Sasquatches were involved in this and i'm not saying they are, but just i wouldn't be majorly surprised if they were. I'll go with some of what Rock says, and i'll add that they Guy was scared to death by what was going on, as he saw them and seeing them absolutely scared the living daylights out of him, as it does so many others. Can people get literally scared to death ? -- Medically speaking, can someone actually be frightened to death? We askedMartin A. Samuels, chairman of the neurology department at Brigham and Women's Hospital in Boston.[An edited transcript of the interview follows. Thanks to AHCJ_Pia for the story suggestion.]Is it possible to literally be scared to death?Absolutely, no question about it.Really? How does that happen?The body has a natural protective mechanism called the fight-or-flight response, which was originally described by Walter Cannon [chairman of Harvard University's physiology department from 1906 to 1942]. If, in the wild, an animal is faced with a life-threatening situation, the autonomic (involuntary) nervous system responds by increasing heart rate, increasing blood flow to the muscles, dilating the pupils, and slowing digestion, among other things. All of this increases the chances of succeeding in a fight or running away from, say, an aggressive jaguar. This process certainly would be of help to primitive humans, but the problem, of course, is that in the modern world there is very limited advantage of the fight-or-flight response. There is a downside to revving up your nervous system like this.How can the fight-or-flight response lead to death?The autonomic nervous system uses the hormone adrenaline, a neurotransmitter, or chemical messenger, to send signals to various parts of the body to activate the fight-or-flight response. This chemical is toxic in large amounts; it damages the visceral (internal) organs such as the heart, lungs, liver and kidneys. It is believed that almost all sudden deaths are caused by damage to the heart. There is almost no other organ that would fail so fast as to cause sudden death. Kidney failure, liver failure, those things don't kill you suddenly.What exactly happens in the heart when it's flooded with too much adrenaline?Adrenaline from the nervous system lands on receptors of cardiac myocytes (heart-muscle cells), and this causes calcium channels in the membranes of those cells to open. Calcium ions rush into the heart cells and this causes the heart muscle to contract. If it's a massive overwhelming storm of adrenaline, calcium keeps pouring into the cells and the muscle just can't relax.There is this specially adapted system of muscle and nerve tissue in the heart—the sinoatrial (SA) node, the atrioventricular node, and the Purkinje fibers—which sets the rhythm of the heart. If this system is overwhelmed with adrenaline, the heart can go into abnormal rhythms that are not compatible with life. If one of those is triggered, you will drop dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cisco Posted October 1, 2015 Share Posted October 1, 2015 I like Rockape's theory and BobbyO's post about being scared to death makes as much sense as anything else. Since there's very little info about what actually happened, Sasquatch is as good a theory as anything else. Within that scenario, I would simplify the story and assume he encountered a Sasquatch that was trying to intimidate him to force him out of the territory. Cullen's heart and brain overloaded with fear and killed him. The Sasquatch then tried to hide his body, knowing that it could attract negative attention. Of course, it could also have been his bookie and some knee breakers that were trying to collect on some bad bets... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ChasingRabbits Posted October 1, 2015 Share Posted October 1, 2015 This whole case is really strange but the cause of death is what confuses me the most. I'm not very familiar with pneumonia but I always thought that it took a while for it to set it. Even then, I didn't think it could kill so quickly. I know that pneumonia can be very dangerous for older people and young children but Cullen was a healthy man. the medical definition of pneumonia is an inflammation of the lungs. The cause of that inflammation can be bacteria or viruses. But it can also be "chemical" in nature like inhaling a gas or a liquid or , in Finnerty's case, his own vomit. When I worked in a children's hospital, there was a case of a toddler developing aspiration pneumonia after choking on apple juice---some of the juice went into the lungs. So like a bacterially or virally caused pneumonia, the aspirate will irritate the lungs, causing inflammation. This results in difficulty breathing (just like would happen with a bacterial pneumonia), fever, reduced oxygen, etc. Vomit contains some stomach acid, so that acid can be very caustic to the lungs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockape Posted October 1, 2015 Author Share Posted October 1, 2015 (edited) But there was no diagnosis of pneumonia, the pathologist was taking a guess there because the lungs showed "signs of pneumonia". One of Finnerty’s lungs showed signs of pneumonia – a type of white blood cells found in the air spaces. Cohle believes he may have vomited and inhaled some of the vomit, and the bacteria may have caused the pneumonia. The pneumonia would have taken several hours to develop, he said.... Cohle, in an interview Thursday, Aug. 8, said he used the evidence he found to construct a likely sequence of events to explain what could have led to Finnerty’s death in late May in the woods of Lake County. He believes he may have become anxious, disoriented and paranoid from being alone in the woods, vomited and inhaled the vomit, and that led to pneumonia in the lung. “It’s complicated. I’m trying to put this together and connect the dots,†Cohle said. “I’m the first to admit I’m doing my best based on the facts we have. I think it’s reasonable to say all this is informed hypothesizing, because nobody knows what was going on out there.†They talk about him being frightened and it being one of the causes... Cohle said the oxycodone in Finnerty’s blood was “moderately elevated†at 260 nanograms per milliliter. It was higher than a therapeutic level of 40, Cohle said, but he did not think it was high enough to cause an overdose death. Although an individual’s tolerance varies, he said the average lethal level is around 1,000. “His level was at the very low end of what is reported to be lethal,†Cohle said.The painkillers and brain disease might have exacerbated Finnerty’s fear and agitation when he was lost in the woods, he added. Family members who talked to him on the phone said he seemed disoriented and was afraid he was being followed. “He may have taken more oxycodone because he was frightened,†Cohle said. “That’s why I think it is a contributing factor.†http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2013/08/cullen_finnertys_cause_of_deat.html Edited October 1, 2015 by Rockape Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 67Mopar Posted October 1, 2015 Share Posted October 1, 2015 (edited) I don't believe drugs, alcohol, or previous injury had anything to do with his death. If Cullen succumbed to a fear/panic reaction, there would have been a cocktail of abnormally high calcium, adrenaline, and other hormones in his system. An examination of his heart tissue and blood would have revealed this. Cullen was conditioned his whole life to deal with confrontations. Was secondary drowning a "bone" thrown to the public, to end speculation? I wonder... Why no investigation? If it took four months to determine a cause of death, why was there no criminal investigation during this four month period? He made several phone calls under extreme duress, which indicated contact with other subjects. The intel clearly indicated a possible assault situation. If CF expired due to a tree falling on him, hit by a car, bit by a snake... I would understand why there would be no investigation. So, I say again... Why was there no criminal investigation? Infrasound is as ridiculous as portals, alien involvement, and Melba's human/unknown other hybrid theory. What people are describing as "infrasound" is likely the effect of fight-or-flight, or their natural sonar warning them of impeding danger. I try not to refer to the species by their media contrived handle "Bigfoot". This term serves only to discredit proponents, and delegitimize research. Edited October 1, 2015 by 67Mopar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ChasingRabbits Posted October 1, 2015 Share Posted October 1, 2015 (edited) Oxycodone is associated with sudden cardiac death, especially when combined with alcohol. http://www.cesar.umd.edu/cesar/drugs/oxycodone.asp Speaking from my experience working in hospitals and clinics, if the pathologists have to send the case "out" to another institution, it means the original pathologist needs help from others in the field to figure it out. It also means the conventional tests they do are coming back inconclusive or the test results don't jive with the physical findings. In the latter, that happens due to lab error. But all test results have to be "clinically correlated". Until about 2011, tough cases used to be sent to the Armed Forces Institute of Pathology (which closed due to the base re-alignment and closure thing). In one instance I can remember, it took AFIP 8 months to give a cause of death for a patient. In another it took AFIP about 5 months. Whatever the cause of death, it's a sad case. Delirium and confusion is scary to the people who witness it happening in another person. So I imagine it's positively frightening for the person it's happening to. :-( Edited October 1, 2015 by ChasingRabbits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyO Posted October 1, 2015 SSR Team Share Posted October 1, 2015 Infrasound is as ridiculous as portals, alien involvement, and Melba's human/unknown other hybrid theory. What people are describing as "infrasound" is likely the effect of fight-or-flight, or their natural sonar warning them of impeding danger. How did you get to the conclusion of the first part ? The second part is possible, but in no way definitive as infrasound is used by a number of wild animals for a number of different reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 67Mopar Posted October 1, 2015 Share Posted October 1, 2015 (edited) I don't care if he was drunk, stoned, and rolling... It still doesn't explain why there was no criminal investigation. Infrasound is as ridiculous as portals, alien involvement, and Melba's human/unknown other hybrid theory. What people are describing as "infrasound" is likely the effect of fight-or-flight, or their natural sonar warning them of impeding danger. The second part is possible, but in no way definitive as infrasound is used by a number of wild animals for a number of different reasons. None of which are primates. Edited October 1, 2015 by 67Mopar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExTrumpet Posted October 1, 2015 Share Posted October 1, 2015 ... Infrasound is as ridiculous as portals, alien involvement, and Melba's human/unknown other hybrid theory. What people are describing as "infrasound" is likely the effect of fight-or-flight, or their natural sonar warning them of impeding danger. I try not to refer to the species by their media contrived handle "Bigfoot". This term serves only to discredit proponents, and delegitimize research. Many people think the belief in an unknown bipedal primate is ridiculous. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyO Posted October 2, 2015 SSR Team Share Posted October 2, 2015 None of which are primates. Absolutely, but that's not the case where ultrasound is concerned is it ? And we know that ultrasound has the same type of effect as infrasound on humans, where dizziness, nausea etc is concerned. Furthermore it can badly damage hearing and even lead to death as per this - http://www.wikilectures.eu/index.php/Effects_of_Ultrasound There are known species of primates that omit ultrasound, and those species originate in SE Asia. They also omit some of the most extreme ultrasound known in the animal kingdom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 67Mopar Posted October 2, 2015 Share Posted October 2, 2015 ... Infrasound is as ridiculous as portals, alien involvement, and Melba's human/unknown other hybrid theory. What people are describing as "infrasound" is likely the effect of fight-or-flight, or their natural sonar warning them of impeding danger. I try not to refer to the species by their media contrived handle "Bigfoot". This term serves only to discredit proponents, and delegitimize research. Many people think the belief in an unknown bipedal primate is ridiculous. LOL! I thought about that, right after I posted it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ChasingRabbits Posted October 2, 2015 Share Posted October 2, 2015 I don't care if he was drunk, stoned, and rolling... It still doesn't explain why there was no criminal investigation. Maybe there was nothing that indicated it was criminal? If Finnerty's death resulted from him losing his footing and falling 300 ft, there would be no criminal investigation unless there was something that pointed to him being pushed or thrown down. If he misused prescription drugs (taking too many, taking them with street drugs, taking them with alcohol, etc.) and death resulted from it, it probably won't result in a criminal investigation UNLESS there was some kind of prescription fraud. For example, he gets his prescription narcotics from a "pill mill". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExTrumpet Posted October 2, 2015 Share Posted October 2, 2015 I don't care if he was drunk, stoned, and rolling... It still doesn't explain why there was no criminal investigation. Maybe there was nothing that indicated it was criminal? If Finnerty's death resulted from him losing his footing and falling 300 ft, there would be no criminal investigation unless there was something that pointed to him being pushed or thrown down. If he misused prescription drugs (taking too many, taking them with street drugs, taking them with alcohol, etc.) and death resulted from it, it probably won't result in a criminal investigation UNLESS there was some kind of prescription fraud. For example, he gets his prescription narcotics from a "pill mill". Someone calling and saying they were being followed and then they show up dead? There's enough there alone to investigate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roguefooter Posted October 3, 2015 Share Posted October 3, 2015 (edited) ^If he had a degenerative brain disease affecting his thinking and judgment, then there would be no reason to suspect foul play. It also wasn't the first time that he displayed paranoia of being followed- http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2013/07/documents_detail_ex-gvsu_quart.html "Jennifer Finnerty told investigators that it wasn't the first time her husband, Cullen Finnerty, had a "paranoid" episode. Eighteen months earlier, she said, he drove 150 miles to Grand Rapids from Detroit because he feared the FBI was following him." Instead of driving home from Detroit a year-and-a-half earlier, he took off for Grand Rapids in western Michigan due to fears the FBI would follow him, she said. According to Jennifer Finnerty, her husband remained in a state of panic for four to five days. Cullen Finnerty had a past addiction to painkillers, said his wife, who believed a pill he was given by an acquaintance may have caused the paranoia that spurred his trip to Grand Rapids." So he had a past experience where he took painkillers and had a paranoid experience that lasted several days. This outdoors trip sounds no different: "Jennifer Finnerty told police her husband called her around the same time. Cullen Finnerty called out, "Hey, are you there?" three times, she said. He said he was talking to "that guy" and believed someone was 20 feet behind him. She heard rustling noises on the other end of the line and asked her husband what he was doing. Finnerty told his wife that he was taking off his clothes. She told him to stay put, and the call was disconnected. Jennifer Finnerty said she then sent her husband a text message that instructed him not to move, because her brother and father were coming to pick him up." ^^More paranoid experiences after taking painkillers. I don't think it's any coincidence. This guy had a brain injury and combined with painkillers made him go off his rocker. Edited October 3, 2015 by roguefooter 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 67Mopar Posted October 3, 2015 Share Posted October 3, 2015 (edited) ^If he had a degenerative brain disease affecting his thinking and judgment, then there would be no reason to suspect foul play. It also wasn't the first time that he displayed paranoia of being followed- http://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/index.ssf/2013/07/documents_detail_ex-gvsu_quart.html "Jennifer Finnerty told investigators that it wasn't the first time her husband, Cullen Finnerty, had a "paranoid" episode. Eighteen months earlier, she said, he drove 150 miles to Grand Rapids from Detroit because he feared the FBI was following him." Cullen made several phone calls in reference to being followed, and was subsequently found dead. Did he imagine that as well? Edited October 3, 2015 by 67Mopar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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