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Ike, Short on time today, but you took at swipe at Nathan's post. I'm not here to protect Nathan by any means, but I've watched as the years and posts have gone by and just because he's not the big cheese around here it's easy to make a sarcastic remark, as you did when you posted ... "riding trains" .....so I hoped you'd take the bait and read about primates and birds that do similar feats and have been recorded doing so. However, I'm not always here 24 hrs a day and find it hard to make time to read every single solitary word that's been posted but I didn't want that statement to slide. They have been filmed doing such things.....wow, how about a raven or crow riding a bottle cap down a snowy roof in Russia........over and over and over........you think he's having fun? Pigeons have for a long time ridden the train from NYC to Rockaway (I believe) and I'll look for the video.,

Distinct possibility. The sheer volume of close proximity reports cannot be denied or glossed over. Are each and everyone of these errors or lies? Some? Yes undoubtedly. Most? Quite possibly. All? Highly unlikely.

Since a few seem to miss or not appreciate my sense of humor, let's dig a bit deeper and address the meat of the matter shall we? To Sunflower I don't know what kind of personal swipe you're trying to take, but there's no joke on me. Birds commonly ride on hippopotamai as well, so what does that have to do with the price of tea in China? If your implication is that pigeons ride trains in New York, ergo bigfeet ride trains as well, allow me to introduce you to the concept of apples and oranges. Random birds landing on random trains and just happening to go along for the ride is quite a different concept than said birds deliberately catching a lift from the Brooklyn to Manhattan for a fine dining experience. When you can demonstrate that earthbound forest animals such as bears, moose, elk, bobcats, deer, et al hop trains for the express purpose to commute to the next town or feeding ground over, you might have something that could potentially spill over to an unknown primate following suit. However, I'll go so far as to state that you will be exceptionally hard pressed to find any of these animals even accidentally going for rides on trains, much less doing it on purpose. Be sure to let us know when you can provide those documented reports. To go one better, there have been numerous accounts of foreign nationals hiding in the landing gear wells of airplanes entering the US, so why no reports of bigfeet doing that? On second thought...don't answer that question...I wouldn't want to be the one responsible for starting that bit of bigfootery "fact." Moving onwards and upwards, I would be more intrigued to see why the concepts such as those that Nathan states: "Primates take shortcuts to better them selves, from stealing food to riding on moving objects to get where they want to go," and "Nothing is off limits to brainy primates if it is advantageous to them" haven't been taken to task yet (not him personally, but the concept). Overall, I am prone to agree with those statements, albeit with small reservations. Specifically, I'm not aware of reports on monkeys deliberately hopping trains to go places...conceivable I suppose, but if so, I seriously doubt they have a destination in mind. Nonetheless, this philosophy doesn't jive well with a certain cadre of folks on here that have shall we say...a more "liberal" view of bigfoot. I don't have to dig too far to find all kinds of comments with emphatic statements that 'bigfeet can (and have) operate digital cameras if they choose to, but don't want or need modern human conveniences like fire, tools, or wheels.' I can't wait to see the verbal contortion act to explain away why these creatures, who as so many on here say "is smarter than humans" consciously choose to live like animals or pre-humans, yet have lower themselves to modern human level in order to catch a train to go visit relatives.

Honestly, I don't even wonder anymore - I KNOW they would be better off without us "discovering" them officially. Some say - We can protect their habitat. What indication do we have that that is even necessary? Some say - We can protect them. They can protect themselves - they have so far. Besides how can we protect them by proving them. That will bring the previous non-believing trophy hunters out of the woodwork searching for that ultimate trophy. Not to mention the money hungry crazies and what they might do....including TV producers. I can't think of one realistic thing we could do that would better their lives- that they would want from us. They don't want/need our help, or they would have made contact by now and asked for help. But I still want to know. Which is very selfish. But I am just human and the curiosity is killing me!