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To continue the discussion I would like to add my observations regarding arches and tree breaks (I purposefully ignore tree structures presently, because they are much more complex, and I feel their manufacture involves more complexity). Last summer, after observing many tree breaks and arches that appeared to me to be due to other than natural causes, I began to photographically document and record their GPS x-y locations. Some observations in mixed coniferous montane forests (pine, spruce, fir, aspen trees at elevations of 8500 – 11,000 feet) over the last few years: Tree Breaks 67 tree breaks described. All involved Aspen trees. Range of tree diameter at break = 2.6 - 6.2 inches. Breaks occur from 2.2 to 15.7 feet above the ground level (median just above 8 feet). About 2/3 of the breaks exhibit obvious left rotation of a few to many degrees (max about 15* - most a few degrees only). All the observed breaks are within 100 yards of a human trail – some next to a trail, some within view from a trail, some well removed from a trail (but not far). 65 of the 67 breaks lean toward the trail – usually within 10-15* directly toward the trail (I have observed only 2 breaks that lean in the 180* azimuth away from a trail). I am including a few photos of some breaks. One of the included breaks has with it a personal story that I will relate if a discussion ensues. Arches 34 arches have been described (many more have been observed). The arches are what I say are graceful curves with a fairly consistent radius. All arches involved Aspen trees – thin saplings in every case (2 – 5 inch diameter near base). Arches were made (or occurred) while the saplings were alive and supple, although most are now dead and brittle. About half (16) have their tips anchored into the ground and then pinned with a branch (usually a short aspen branch) inserted at a low angle over the arch tip. One arch in particular was pinned in a much more complex way – see my photos in an earlier post in this thread. Once the aspen arch sapling has died the pinning branch can be removed with the arch remaining in place, so some of the older arches may have had pins removed by natural or other forces (I see no way to have determined this). In other words, all arches may have been pinned at one time. Aspen arches made during the current summer growing season (2018) rebound to some degree if they are unpinned. As a general observation – I have hiked through numerous aspen groves that do not contain a single break or arch (or other structure) that I would consider anomalous. Then, in some of those groves, it seems like I have crossed a sharp boundary and entered a zone with numerous breaks and arches (and structures and tangled, intertwined aspens – like a fence) that appear anomalous. Wind and snow certainly work in wondrous ways!

Correct. Nothing can change my mind but a face to face encounter or a body on a slab. Anything else is speculation, anecdotal evidence,wishful thinking, misidentification, and of course lies

would ,love to hear the story that you alluded to regarding one of those breaks As promised, here goes: I have had two gifting sites in the Colorado Rocky Mountains for a few years now. During the Summer 2016 activity started in July with increasing intensity into mid-September during which there were a number of amazing encounters. The last of the above photos of aspen breaks relates to a vicarious encounter September 14, 2016. The photo of the break was taken 7/23/2016. It is just downhill from a trail I was taking every 3-5 days between my two gift sites, which are about 1/2 mile apart. I have stopped to admire that tree break at least 20 times - alone, with my niece, with my squatching buddy. On 9/14/16 I stopped to admire it - then continued to my gift site for a brief visit. Upon my return I found an aspen sapling placed perpendicularly across my path such that I would have tripped over it had I not removed it. As I continued hiking I kept thinking "it looks just like the top of my aspen break!" Sure enough when I reached the aspen break the top was missing. In 30 or more hikes on that trail I have encountered only one hiker (the Forest Service closed the trail years ago - sorry, that is why I use it). There were no cars in the trailhead parking area, which is also remote. I later paced off the distance the top was from the bottom - 98 yards. That, along with other intense activity in late Summer, led me to believe it was a vicarious acknowledgement that a friend was telling me she (tell you later) wanted me to know she is here (not necessarily a teaser - rather I feel uncomfortable relating events that will be certain to subject me to scorn). See attached photo with redacted notes.

US Forest service is already ahead of you on the coverup! Physical Factors Aspen is affected by a variety of physical and mechanical factors as well. As aspen is very intolerant of shade, the lack of light may affect tree vigor and regeneration. Mature aspen trunks may sunscald if they are abruptly exposed to large increases in sunlight. Wind can sometimes severely impact an aspen grove as would a severe forest fire. Trees are blown down and broken, the area is opened up, and aspen suckering is stimulated. Snowstorms may do extensive damage to aspen if the snow is wet and clings to the aspen crowns. Limbs may break, sapling to pole size trees may be broken off, bent to the ground, and sometimes partially uprooted. Weather-related phenomenon, such as hail and lightning, temperature extremes, and drought may damage aspen.

If you want denials just ask them face to face. The WA DNR ignored an information request I made via email. The USFS and National Park Service have denied knowledge about BF at different situations for me. Me or my hiking companion simply naively ask if they know of sightings in their area when we stop by a Ranger station in a new area. The answer so far as been no except in one case down in Oregon. That Ranger said someone had reported a sighting. She was an older woman and probably had been there for a long time. We drove out to the area and looked around since we were camping nearby. That was up NF-19 out of Oakridge Oregon. River runs through the area so I would say it would be likely BF habitat. I don't wear BF T shirts or indicate I know anything about the subject. That makes me suspicious when BFRO reports have encounters in an area and some of them report having notified a Ranger who don't seem know anything about it. Even if I did not have personal experience, I would probably say I have heard of reports if I was a Ranger. You would not have to say you believe them. Unless, as I suspect, their official policy is to deny it. I will continue to ask, just in case another Ranger feels like being honest.

Yes, to camping and outdoor pix!

Not when you are at least 50/50 sure the thing is behaviorally people and / or biologically human even if technologically incredibly primitive. For instance, I wouldn't deliberately kill a Homo habilis "specimen" if I found a remaining tribe wandering the woods .. except in self defense. Murder is not one of the techniques of archeology I was taught in college. If I find they are something else, something other than simple earthly F&B, then I'll reconsider. MIB