N A W A C - Field Study Discussion

[Guest]

  Kiamichi Mountains

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The Kiamichi Mountains are a mountain range in southeastern Oklahoma. A subrange within the larger Ouachita Mountains that extend from Oklahoma to western Arkansas,^[1] the Kiamichi Mountains sit within Le Flore, Pushmataha, and McCurtain counties near the towns of Poteau and Albion. The foothills of the Kiamichi Mountains sit within Haskell County, Northern Le Flore County, and Northern Pittsburg County.^[2] Its peaks, which line up south of the Kiamichi River, reach 2,500 feet in elevation.^[3] The range is the namesake of Kiamichi Country, the official tourism designation for southeastern Oklahoma.

The Kiamichi Mountains.

Black bear, coyote, bobcat, deer, cougar, minks, bats, bald eagles, varieties of woodpeckers, doves, owls, road runners and 328 vertebrate species are native to this region.^{[4] AND BIGFOOT}

The Kiamichi Mountains are ancient. By projecting the existing mountains down to their subsurface roots geologists know that they once stood as tall as the modern-day Rocky Mountains, which are much younger. The highly serrated, jagged appearance of the Rockies and other tall mountain ranges may be attributed to their youth. By contrast the Kiamichi Mountains, which are much older—and now shorter—feature the highly eroded characteristics common among much older mountains.

Geologists generally define a mountain as a natural landform topping at least 1,000 feet in elevation. Numerous of the mountains, particularly those along the Kiamichi River’s lower reaches, measure between 700 and 900 feet in elevation. Although called “mountains†they are, more formally, hills.

Precise definitions of the extent and scope of the Kiamichi Mountains have never been formally assigned. They constitute more of a cultural construct than formal geographical designation. Local residents generally identify the mountains as those occurring on either side of the Kiamichi River along the full extent of its course, until it flows into the flat coastal plain of southern Oklahoma.

Several groupings of mountains—all subranges of the Ouachita Mountains—may be found in southeastern Oklahoma, some of them associated with the Kiamichi Mountains, and some not.

North of the Kiamichi Mountains are the Winding Stair Mountains, named by early American explorers for their cascading appearance as a series of stair steps.

East of Little River are the Bok Tuklo Mountains, which are commonly considered a continuation of the Kiamichi Mountains, although far removed from the namesake river. These mountains take their name from Bok Tuklo County in the old Choctaw Nation. Bok Tuklo, in the Choctaw language, means “two creeks†and refers to Lukfata Creek and Yasho Creek, both in McCurtain County, Oklahoma.^[5]

Portions of the mountains are protected by the Upper Kiamichi River Wilderness National Wildlife Refuge and the Ouachita National Forest. The wildlife refuge includes much of the Kiamichi River’s upper reaches and headwaters. The National Forest exists as two spurs, or arms, of its larger area in Arkansas, and may be found in Le Flore County and McCurtain County.

Substantial portions of the mountains are owned by timber companies, who operate massive tree plantations consisting of fast-growing pine trees. Logging is the region’s chief industry.

Tourism is also important, although it makes a smaller economic impact. The Talimena Scenic Drive, connecting Talihina, Oklahoma with Mena, Arkansas is a popular destination during autumn. [Fishing] is popular year-round, as is hunting during hunting season.

Oklahoma’s state government has designated southeastern Oklahoma as Kiamichi Country, in an effort to identify and market its tourism potential. Several flood control reservoirs built and maintained by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers or the state, including Broken Bow Lake, Clayton Lake, McGee Creek Lake, Pine Creek Lake, and Sardis Lake (Oklahoma), are framed by views of the mountains and add to the area’s scenic beauty.

Due to the restricted nature of land ownership in the region—with much of it owned by the federal government or timber companies—the Kiamichi Mountains remain rustic, rural, economically undeveloped and with few population centers.

[Guest]

Those interested in the work of the NAWAC will be interested in the new episode of the Bigfoot Show. 

 

http://thebigfootshow.com/2013/09/22/episode-54-further-adventures-in-a-land-called-x/

[Guest]

To a certain extent, yes, but we've sold most of our cameras in order to raise funds for other equipment. 

You should have bought the non IR models and played with the gain and exposure.  IR seems to equal wood ape repellant.

http://www.rugged-cctv.com/sentry-dome-camera.shtml

I've been doing work with a 10 IP security camera system this past year and have tweaked them so I can see outlines of people with some detail in a dark room with no windows.  I imagine depending on the moon phase and the leaf canopy over your cabins you could get much clearer video than I was able to get.  If you still have the computer or DVR system the cameras hook up to you might consider this next year.

 

Of course you won't need that if you are able to overcome the branch deflection problem.  Good luck next year and I hope your round selection proves better.  The overwatch tent was a great idea.  The last episode of the BFS was probably the best so I have listened to so far.

[Guest]

We're going to be evaluating some non-IR cameras. Our concern is they'll prove to be very low resolution, but we'll see how they work out. If we think they'd be useful, we'd have them deployed prior to next spring The question we're balancing now is all about resources. We can liquidate the cameras and DVR system and use that money to help acquire more thermal equipment which has proven itself or just dump the cameras and get more. Cameras can't deliver proof, they can only support our efforts to get proof. If we had all the money in the world, we'd buy both. We don't, so, as I said, we're considering our options. 

 

The last episode of the BFS was probably the best I have listened to so far.

 

Thanks, glad you liked it. 

[Painthorse]

Ditto on the great show.

 I was trying to debunk something and was using 3 IR cams, 1 Moultrie @ 2 Stealths. The pic is  the Moultrie IR cam catching the IR flash from the Stealth IR cam.

 

What humans can see is just a pink or red glow when the IR cams are triggered, so if these creatures do have more advanced sight, the IR is a dead giveaway, they may see the white flash from the IR.

Edited September 23, 2013 by Painthorse

[Drew]

Wouldn't really matter if you are in the range of a camera and the flash goes off.  

 

Bipto, have any of your cameras turned up missing, or dismantled and the storage device removed?

[1980squatch]

Those interested in the work of the NAWAC will be interested in the new episode of the Bigfoot Show. 

 

Wow... just.. Wow.

[Guest]

Wouldn't really matter if you are in the range of a camera and the flash goes off.

Depends. Some cameras have a slow firing time. If the animal is fast, you might only get its tail (if anything). There's also the variable of where the animal is in the camera's triggering area when it registers it.

 

Bipto, have any of your cameras turned up missing, or dismantled and the storage device removed?

Not that I'm aware of. We've had one camera totally eaten by a bear (which was observed by another camera as it happened). We've had cameras messed with, but not destroyed. Never had one broken into that I've ever heard of.

[Guest UPs]

Really interesting show and to me, what separates the NAWAC from the other groups is not only the goal of specimen collection, but the sharing of really good information that can help others. I am a bit surprised there is not more discussion of this latest episode, especially about the technique used to observe the animals with the thermal. Who came up with that idea as it really is a simple and cost effective way to remain concealed and observe. Can you discuss any activity that may have happened the weeks after the shot was taken? Did you guys rebuild the blind? Have you thought about using the plastic for the roof as well as the sides of the blind? Did it seem like they knew when there were people in the blind or did you take precautions when entering or leaving? One last question Bipto, if you had been successful, how long before it would have been publicly known? Thanks....UPs

[Guest]

Can you discuss any activity that may have happened the weeks after the shot was taken?

Activity seemed to be about normal after that. We're not sure they understand what guns are or do. They have to have watched humans shoot them numerous times as target practice is a regular part of what happens there when the family is present, but in each of the handful of times we've fired on an animal, there hasn't been an obvious change in behavior. 

 

Did you guys rebuild the blind? Have you thought about using the plastic for the roof as well as the sides of the blind?

We cobbled the crushed blind back into service the best we could for that last week of operations (duct tape and splits!). We're currently designing something better for next year. Perhaps something custom built and with some height to allow for a better view over obstacles and into foliage (which is quite dense and problematic - two men standing within a few feet of one another will often have two entirely different views of heat signatures in the same location). The roof may be plastic, but will likely be something better suited to withstand the weather. If the blind is raised, we'll have better visibility all the way around and a see-through roof won't be as necessary. This year, the relatively low overhang of the canopy did cause some issues for our taller members.

 

Did it seem like they knew when there were people in the blind or did you take precautions when entering or leaving?

Quite definitely. We couldn't enter or exit the blind without a bit of effort and noise. Also, our guys tried to observe light and sound discipline the best they could, but we're certain the animals around there knew we were in what probably looked not unlike a tent to them. I thought the comment by Jordan about how all the local wildlife seemed to come out as soon as Brad started snoring was a fascinating observation of how animals cue off our sounds and actions. 

 

One last question Bipto, if you had been successful, how long before it would have been publicly known?

Very hard to say. There would be a lot of moving parts there. We'd certainly be racing against some intended or unintended leak, so time will be of the essence. However, we want to have the specimen as well documented as possible and thoroughly inspected by qualified individuals before going public.

[Guest Squatchologist]

when do you guys cut off activity at X, i might have missed this, and when do you go back in for more activity

[Cotter]

Tunnels Bipto....tunnels.

[Sunflower]

I only have one comment..........

 

 

            crushed blind = get out!

 

IMHO

[Guest]

when do you guys cut off activity at X, i might have missed this, and when do you go back in for more activity

 

We usually knock off in late summer, though there are sporadic trips through fall and even into winter. We crank it back up when the foliage starts to fill in. 

I only have one comment..........

 

 

            crushed blind = get out!

 

IMHO

 

The gap between the deflected shot and the discovery of the crushed blind was about six weeks (that timing was never explained on the show). There was another thermal sighting in the same general area the very next night, but it was fleeting. The blind wasn't disturbed until after we had cleared out of the area for a week or so, five weeks or so after the shot. It's hard to say the blind was disturbed *because* of the shot. We believe they also ripped up a big teepee we had pitched last year and we never used it for anything like Overwatch. 

 

This isn't the first time we've shot at them, yet they seem to be nearby quite often. If they wanted to harm us, they could have on numerous occasions. Whatever made them want to wreck the blind, it doesn't appear to be an overly violent intent towards us. At least I don't read it that way. 

Tunnels Bipto....tunnels.

 

Or something.

[Guest]

Bip,

 

You mentioned several sightings of the target. Assuming this was with the thermals do you have video?