Sierra Shooting from A-Z

[Guest]

He had the story pretty well down pat until he got to the point where he killed the young one. Something happened that he didn't want the little one anymore and the fact that he keeps claiming the little ones somehow look less human like then the big one could be a subconscious attempt to ease his guilt.

OR, the young one did look less human.

Question - do we know for a fact that Justin killed the Adult? I know he claims to have shot it, but do we have anything solid that he actually did kill it?

[Guest Shaun]

Hi Melissa. I don't think we know anything as fact just yet, we only have Justin's account of what happened, and we can either choose to believe it or not.

We won't know the facts until the evidence is produced and verified.

[Guest]

Thank you Shaun. That is actually my point.

[Guest BFSleuth]

I think the closest we have to confirmation that he did in fact kill the large bigfoot is due to finding the "steak" in an area where he thought it might have died which was not near where he hid the juvenile. He also noted there were grease spots and other indicators that a large animal had died and been largely consumed at that location and the hair on the sample was the same color as what he shot. Final confirmation of course will be when the DNA study is published.

[Guest crabshack]

I am not a hunter and know next to nothing about rifles and ammo etc. I recall Justin saying how the bullet he used was capable of a good bit of damage. Would this bullet leave something as small as the young one alive for a few minutes after being shot in the neck at that distance? It seems like it would blow its spine apart and kill it instantly. Can anyone with hunting knowledge provide some insight for me please?

I think he said a 25-06 was used???

Regardless, yes the bullet would have not had the time and necessary distance of tissue acting on the bullet to expand where it was shot, unless bone was hit, so a cleaner pencil punch through hole would be the wound.

[southernyahoo]

Of course not.........but they are not going to be able to establish a species without a type specimen.....which means a body or a significant portion thereof.

I just read some where (which may or may not be true) that Justin and his friend did not bring the body back to town because they feared legal ramifications over the shooting.........

If this is true then I simply want to gouge my eye balls out. Instead of trying to fiddle fart around trying to wring DNA out of a skin sample that's been laying in the mud for however long? We could already be well on our way to protecting a new SPECIES of primate on the planet.

What's it going to take to push us over the hump? Certainly a change in mindset that's for sure.

I think we are beginning to understand human perception when a person/hunter has a face to face encounter. General is just the type of person that the opportunity would present itself to. His reactions to what he encountered are just as I would expect. Since he had no previous knowledge of them, his mind ran through three or four possibles in just seconds, his lack of emotional attachment to animals gave him the predisposition such that he could take the shot. His reaction after doing that twice is telling about the creature IMO. If what he felt at that point was no different than killing a bear he "would" have brought it home. I'm not sure what it is that turns off a persons desire to confront the world with proof like with a body, but leaves the desire to inform full on.

[Guest]

BFSleuth said:

I think the closest we have to confirmation that he did in fact kill the large bigfoot is due to finding the "steak" in an area where he thought it might have died which was not near where he hid the juvenile. He also noted there were grease spots and other indicators that a large animal had died and been largely consumed at that location and the hair on the sample was the same color as what he shot. Final confirmation of course will be when the DNA study is published.

I'm not sure how anyone can tell the size of a dead animal by looking at the ground after it's been consumed by other animals with no table manners. It is my understanding that once the Adult was hit - it fled into the brush and Justin never seen it again. In all honesty the "steak" could have come from either the juvenile or the Adult. But, we have no confirmation that the Adult was killed. Animals - even after suffering a shot (with massive injuries) can travel quite a distance before finally dying.

To be very honest - in the heat of something like this situation - I am willing to bet there is much that happened that Justin doesn't even remember. That would be a very normal reaction to a situation that had to be very stressful for him and his friend. If Justin told me he was not stressed out - I would not believe him at all. What he has said tells me he was very stressed - to the extreme. And if people are going to assess even half of his story as legitimate - it's only fair that his emotional state during the events be taken into account. I have to wonder if some of his statements (the veracity) is true - or just his frustration at being asked the same questions - giving the same answers - and still being called a liar and a heartless killer.

Edited July 19, 2012 by Melissa

[Guest BFSleuth]

^ I think that's the biggest part of the story that hasn't been told.

I was watching the interview with Bobo last night and he said he's talked with Justin quite a bit. One aspect he mentioned that I hadn't heard in Justin's interview or the Sierra Shootings thread is this:

It was getting toward dark and JS and Driver were both getting concerned that if there was one parent then there would possibly be another parent in the area.

This IMHO would be a spooky situation to say the least. If you just shot momma and one of the kids, then what would be the repercussions if daddy showed up? When I try to put myself in their shoes at that moment (with blood from the juvenile on my boots), getting dark, steep terrain, and potentially more "monsters" in the area... I think that would give me some pause to consider hauling a 35 lb animal back to the truck.

The spook factor must have been pegged at 10.

[Guest Thepattywagon]

If there was evidence at the location where the 'steak' was found that the body had been disposed of where it ultimately fell, it makes me question two things;

One is the number of scat piles found in the road. 40 piles would indicate a sizeable number of animals, would it not?

And if there are so many of them, why didn't they collect their fallen family member and do what they allegedly do with their dead, as in either bury it or at least remove it to a 'safe' place.

Or maybe they don't do these things after all?

[Guest]

Well question, Pattywagon.. Do we know all those scat piles were bigfoot? I don't know the answer to that. Did Justin count them one by one? Or, did he estimate?

[Guest BFSleuth]

One aspect that JS doesn't seem to cover in his interview, but was covered by Bobo's recent interview based on conversations with JS, is that it was getting dark and there was concern that if they shot one parent then it might be possible that another parent could be in the area.

Putting myself in JS's shoes at that moment, with it getting dark, in steep terrain with cover all around them, that would be enough to tighten my sphincter for days. Not sure if the sizeable scat piles entered their mind at the time, but I would have to imagine that might have played a part. With that many piles it could be reasonable to conclude that they were not alone.

I certainly wouldn't want to be there in that situation after dark.

Regarding which animal the "steak" came from, I think JS noted the color of the big one was a pretty good match to the hair on the sample. He noted the juveniles were much darker in color.

[Guest Thepattywagon]

And yet driver didn't get out of the truck with a weapon, nor did he go back to get one at any point, even after the little ones appeared and were scurrying around them chattering.

[Guest BFSleuth]

^ That is a conundrum... I would love to listen to an interview with the Driver, perhaps together with JS.

[Guest]

BFSleuth said:

One aspect that JS doesn't seem to cover in his interview, but was covered by Bobo's recent interview based on conversations with JS, is that it was getting dark and there was concern that if they shot one parent then it might be possible that another parent could be in the area.

Well, personally, you would be stupid to not consider that possibility. IF that was the thought after shooting the first or even the second animal - my guess is their nerves were set on high.. The adrenaline had to be flowing for both men. These are the types of situations that set people up for PTSD. I'm not saying Justin or his friend suffer from PTSD - but I would not be shocked if one or both did. I would honestly expect it.

The "steak" could have come from the Adult - but that does not mean the Adult died.

Putting myself in JS's shoes at that moment, with it getting dark, in steep terrain with cover all around them, that would be enough to tighten my sphincter for days.

Amen!! LOL.

[Guest Thepattywagon]

Well question, Pattywagon.. Do we know all those scat piles were bigfoot? I don't know the answer to that. Did Justin count them one by one? Or, did he estimate?

I think it was an estimate, but I believe he said they'd been running across them all day.

I also think he stated that he knew they weren't bear or cat.